Yay!!! Another no start situation.

[Travis Koch]

So here is what we know so far.

Just got the car, not running, never heard it run.  1991 Talon TSi FWD.  Modified w / FMIC, big 16G, pistons, balance shaft delete, 720cc injectors, Walbro 255, AEM EMS series 1.  Apparently, the day after replacing the pump the car no longer started.

First thing, Removed head to check valves..... all is good.  Reassemble engine components and time.  Timing is now good!

Compression check 170, 165, 165, 170.  Compression is good!

Pulled CAS and did a check for spark and injector firing.  All plugs fire and all injectors tick open as intended.

Fuel pump runs and delivery is good.  Pulled return line off to check flow.  That's good too.  (No pressure test as I do not have a gauge)


Right now the car cranks, and cranks, and cranks, but no go....... it puffed once!

Here are the unknowns.

Do I have a vacuum leak?  Owner removed boost controller and left the vacuum lines as is.  Not sure how it was connected as of yet but i tried a couople configurations and no change.  Not sure how this would keep it from firing.

Is the EMS bad?  Can't connect to AEM EMS due to not having the correct cable.  I will be hunting one down so if there is one out there, please let me know, maybe I can borrow one.  If plugs spark and injectors fire then can I assume my injector drivers are good?  (Have cable now, all i need is the knowledge to use it.....)

The intercooler piping right before the throttle body has what I assume is an air temp sensor, as the MAF has been deleted.  I was under the impression that one would need a MAP when the MAF is deleted but I don't see one.  The ATS and MAP need to work in conjuntion don't they?

That's all I can think of right now, except, the gas doesn't smell bad, but I may replace the fuel anyways. Replaced fuel

I'll stew on this for a bit and update as I go.  Any insight would be appreciated.  Gotta go to work now.

[Brent Hunter]

Check your Ecu coolant temp sensor, I had a similar problem on both my talons and the temp sensor was the problem.

[Bryan Hoytema]

ya maybe you will have to get inside the EMS and check out what tune the car is on, I read the craigs list add from the guy. very good deal!! no brainer to pick up !:) can't remember if the guys said he upgraded when he changed the fuelpump but when he swapped the fuel pump maybe the ECU can't distinguish the new 255 pump and is trying to run the old stock pump, ?sounds like you might need an adjustable FPR (fuel press reg.)

[Jordan Kruger]

Make sure you have that boost guage line either plugged or deleted.  You dont want any vacuum leaks and that is a guaranteed leak.
I would start by pulling the spark plugs and checking that all of them get spark , if you have already determined that there is fuel.
If its not a fuel problem   and its not a spark problem  then move onto fuses/electronic connections.

[Travis Koch]

  Well FUCK ME!!! 

   Thanks for the ideas so far but get this.......  I get home today and replace the fuel with Shell silver (89 octane) I think.  Well, no surprise, the car did not want to start.
  Just for shits and giggles I decided to swap the EMS for an ECU from a 94 auto Non-turbo, and as if by devine intervention the damn ting fires up and idles.
The best part is, just to be sure I plugged the AEM unit back in and VVVROOOOOOOMMM!!!

Now, I'm not saying the problem is solved but things are looking good.  I will need to sort out the vacuum line vs. boost control situation as the idle wants to sit at 2500 with waste gate and blow off valve connected unless I pinch the line, which of course, negates the effects of both.

I have a friend trying to get me sorted out with a cable and a dedicated laptop with a serial connector or an adapter to use a USB..  We'll see how this turns out. 

Bryan, Good thought about the pump, there is an adjustable FPR but not sure what to do with it since I have no fuel pressure gauge..... YET!!
Brent, I will definitely be checking out all the sensors as things progress, there are alot of things disconnected/deleted from the stock system.

[Robert Vorley]

Was it a loose ecu connector then?

[Travis Koch]

 /not sure, just letting things sit for awhile, then I'll try again, although the connectors seemed secure.

[Mike Canzian]

so just to get things straight you plugged the old ecu in it fired up then you turned it off and plugged in the after market ems and it still started up and ran???

issues like that ive come across are usually configuration issues with the ems unit. either that or something want plugged in lol

[Travis Koch]

Yah Mike, that is exactly what I am saying...

HOWEVER, there is still alot of testing to do on sensors and such before I'll be satisified. The idle came down a bit after messing with the FIAV, I may consider doing the bypass......does anyone have a bypass plate they don't need?........ ISC seems to function as it cycles when the key is turned on and off.

Now if I could just find my Frickin Multimeter!!!

I can now hook up to the EMS and as far as i can tell it is operting soundly.  Can someone tell me how to bring the data to my laptop for perusal later.  I downloaded the data log file but there doesn't seen to be any usable data there.  This will be fun to learn I'm sure.

If anybody wants to drop by this weekend and have a peek let me know, I could use some help drinking beer.

[Brett Haviland]

good to hear you got her running.... ill have to come by and check it out!

[Travis Koch]

Yah, totally Brett, anytime!!

  Did some more checking and I replaced the FIAV with another I had. Idle has come down and  I smoothed it out by adjusting the BISS, only, the idle is still around 1500.  Need to set base timing but does anyone know if the procedure still applies when you have the AEM controlling things or is the EMS taking care of that for me.

  I'm satisfied that it will not blow up on me,  haha,  even if the Beast want's to pull me off the road sideways when I hit the accelerator.  Speaking of acceleration, the throttle response was lagging so I thought about a new cable but I ended up winding the spring on the throttle body one more time around and this smartened it up right quick.  Anybody tried this before?

Oh well, regardless, I would like to analyze the MAP for the EMS but I as of yet know diddly squat about this unit, maybe a bit more than diddly.  Can anybody show me a thing or two or would I be better off taking the car to RG or something?

[Jason Harwood]

Take the car to a tuner for 2 hours to get dialed in properly. Messing around with the AEM will be a headache if youre not native to it

Yah, totally Brett, anytime!!

  Did some more checking and I replaced the FIAV with another I had. Idle has come down and  I smoothed it out by adjusting the BISS, only, the idle is still around 1500.  Need to set base timing but does anyone know if the procedure still applies when you have the AEM controlling things or is the EMS taking care of that for me.

  I'm satisfied that it will not blow up on me,  haha,  even if the Beast want's to pull me off the road sideways when I hit the accelerator.  Speaking of acceleration, the throttle response was lagging so I thought about a new cable but I ended up winding the spring on the throttle body one more time around and this smartened up right quick.  Anybody tried this before?

Oh well, regardless, I would like to analyze the MAP for the EMS but I as of yet know diddly squat about this unit, maybe a bit more than diddly.  Can anybody show me a thing or two or would I be better off taking the car to RG or something?

[Travis Koch]

 Thanks Jason, that's exactly where I'm at as of this morning.  One thing left to check is the fuel pressure.

[daniel Dee]

You can spend months playing around with the AEM EMS
Assuming nothing is broken,

Lowell (RG) can dial it in in minutes
if the laptop can keep up with him..